Does anyone else sometimes feel like some time AWAY from the guitar can help their playing?

yep. im going to say there is some pure gold in that book. Chap 2 from sections 12-17 has many nuggets. of course people must form their own philosophy but mine is quickly coming together. (wish id worked it out 30 years ago lol)

http://www.pianofundamentals.com/book/en/1.II.13

its great because he touches both ends of the spectrum. The good AND bad of practicing fast AND slow.

" Playing so fast that you start to feel stress and make mistakes will not improve technique because you are just practicing mistakes and acquiring bad habits. Forcing the fingers to play the same way faster is not the way to increase speed."

So he is against trying to force things too quickly and thus just ingraining mistakes, but he is also against endlessly repeating something slowly that might not work when u speed up.

ā€œIf you do not make significant progress in a few minutes, you are probably doing something wrong ā€“ think of something new. Students who use the intuitive method are resigned to repeating the same thing for hours with little visible improvement. That mentality must be avoided in order to learn faster.ā€

ā€œthe need to attain speed quickly and to practice accurately become contradictory. The solution is to constantly change the speed of practice; do not stay at any one speed for too long. For very difficult passages that require skills you donā€™t already have, there is no alternative but to bring the speed up in stages. For this, use speeds that are too fast as exploratory excursions to determine what needs to be changed in order to play at such speeds. Then slow down and practice those new motions.ā€

Basically he says to try something faster than you current manageable best speed to see how it goes and what needs to be changed to get to that speedā€¦but only do a few reps! lol

I checked out a piano forum and they were discussing the book. Naturally some loved it and some hated it. In the end though they came into agreement that the ā€œslow to fast ratioā€ of practice should be about 2/3rd slow and 1/3 fast with some saying as much as 9 parts slow practice to 1 part fast.

I have been trying to work on some licks in desc thirds starting on the top string but, true to my old self, id try a few times and when it fell off the tracks id leave it for something else. So I ran across that book last Thurs. So I decided to try some of the techniques.

So on Friday I started with the few good notes I had to start with, which was basically going to end up being a descending D mixolydian lick working its way down to end on an e note. So basically I sat there and tried to work out an exact fingering. I tried several different ways, especially for the goofy b to g string etc.

came up with this in 16ths:

eā€”10-14-10-12ā€“10
b-------------------13ā€“12-13-10-12ā€“10
g----------------------------------------12ā€“11-12-9-11ā€”9
d------------------------------------------------------------12ā€“10-12-9-10ā€”9
a--------------------------------------------------------------------------------12ā€“10-12-9-10-7

pretty much just desc thirds with the exception of the first note lol

well obviously you see its a tangle of back and forth and lots of double escaping etc. Luckily I have had good success on the Paul Gilbert lick lately, partially by using lots of vain repetitions lol

So I worked out the fingering on Fri. worked on it some slowly etc. knowing me i tried it fast at several point too, or at least portions of it. (I also worked out a simpler sextuplet lick on 2 strings which I was closer to being fast on. so i was splitting my time between 2 licks)

Saturday I went to work and actually did mental practice on the lick lol. That was a first for me. Its interesting because you have to decide what to visualize. visualize the tab? (nah). the fingers? the fretboard??but from what point of view?

so at work Sat I wrote out the tab and wrote lines to divide it into sections of 4 notes and I worked on it mentally during the day

Came home Sat just dead tired and only managed 30 minutes practice, splitting the time between my 2 new licks

Today I did 50 mins of practice this morning. some slow etc, then tried fast a few times. At one point the lick just popped out WAY faster than I thought I could do. This was near the end of that session this morning. So now I will gradually up the practice speed without pushing too fast into mistakeland.

So all told, on Fri my diary shows 80 mins total practice time. This was partially spent working out the 2 licks. Then grooving them slowly. Sat I did mental practice at work then a very tired 30 mins at night. This morning a 50 min session and basically I now have a complicated desc thirds pattern grooved pretty well.

Im sort of sold.

of course now I need to repeat the method and figure out how to optimize things etc

In the ā€œslow vs fastā€ philosophy wars, I see the need for both but im heavily leaning towards the ā€œDONT GROOVE MISTAKESā€ side of things. I think the whole ā€œomg, slow practice form isnt the same as fast formā€ mantra is way overblown, especially for advanced players and/or us modern folks who now have more conscious knowledge of mechanics. Maybe the slower form isnt exactly the sameā€¦neither is a form where im making 50% mistakes!

The dude who wrote the book is like 80 something now lol. I might still write him with some questions hehe

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I think ā€˜visualiseā€™ isnā€™t the best word because that sort of implies that you imagine watching yourself do it, whereas you should be imagining doing it, from the same point of view you would normally practise from i.e. attuned to your fingers, the sound, the feel, etc.

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yeah I am going to work on it going forward I guess. Its funny because when I was about 17-18 I had a book called ā€œPeak Performanceā€ by Charles Garfield. It went into detail on sports visualization etc. of course at 18 I unfortunately wasnt quite ready lol

image

can someone click on this email and figure out what Chuan Changā€™s email address is? I use web based email so it wont show it to me

http://www.pianopractice.org/

[email protected]
Post must be at least 20 characters.

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thanks brother, imma send ol boy some questions lol

Yes, the brain needs time to digest the feed. Is like a pc, you are saving files on your drive. If you try to store new data while saving, this new input will be sent to the saving queue. But because we are humans, the queue will be dropped to the thrash by your brain selectively, depending on your organics, that is : your drive space and speed, your procesor power , the RAM, etcā€¦All is in your brain. If you try to practice 5 minutes some challenging stuff, a little bit out of your scope, then leave the guitar for other 5 m, and then play the same thing

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When I used to play in a band and we first started gigging I started having a few beers at rehearsal because I wouldnā€™t. And then when we played gigs I would, and I couldnā€™t play as good as when I was sober LOL

For what itā€™s worth, that magical feeling of effortlessness lasted for a couple days but now things feel pretty normal again. Odd.

I have a feeling that relaxation is a MASSIVE key. Sometimes the more you practice, the more you expect, and the more tension creeps in. Whereas sometimes your fastest licks are sort of effortless and accidental

golf is a direct correlation. if you stand at the range and hit drivers you might hit some good shots and get all yummy feeling inside but then you swing that itsy bitsy bit harder and little by little it all falls apart

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There is the skill acquisition phase of learning which is physiological and that takes time, however also I find that thereā€™s a psychological phenomenon at play when I take time off and step back a little.

As we all know practicing and playing involves a lot of critical and constructive personal judgements. Stepping back allows me to enjoy the fruits of my labor that I wouldnā€™t notice before as I am too wrapped up in my head on whatever Iā€™m working on at that time.

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I strongly believe itā€™s down to strength, more specifically strength in certain ranges of motion.
The ability to hold a pick loose and tight in a certain ROM is everything in terms of fluidity and ease of playing.

This is why most people hold a pick between thumb and index, itā€™s naturally an effective grip allowing loose and tense grip.

But for someone like Eddie van halen, he has hypermobility of the thumb, letting him grip really effectively between thumb and middle finger. This gives him certain advantages, and a big reason why his playing is soā€¦ akward for a lot of index players.

I really enjoy the EVH technique. It feels good, I also love the Gypsy jazz/ Marty friedman technique. They just give a energized feeling that brings about interesting playing.
But I donā€™t have the hands they do, it becomes very hard for me to remain fluid in their techniques without extended rest. My hands can not produce the forces theirs can in the angles or range of motion theirs can. And this lack of fluidity over time proves to me itā€™s all about strength and endurance in certain angles and range of motion.

Itā€™s something Iā€™m constantly struggling with, just like how people with long hair just seem to be more legitimate guitar players. Itā€™s bullshitā€¦ but itā€™s a show of virility and strength. A lions mane. Though thatā€™s a different topicā€¦

I have flip flopped my opinion on this over the years.
When I was young and something worked for me I was staunchly opposed to the idea of it not being what everyone should do. Unfortunately I struggle with that thinking still today, but my current belief is this is an unanswerable question in any concrete way.

I go through phases where I play endlessly and then something takes me away for a while. When I return there is often a renewed energy for me.

So naturally I would be in favour of breaks.
The problem I have encountered at times like joining the military, getting strung out on drugs, Jiu jitsu etc. Lol?
Is the length of the break is the question.
Itā€™s the difference between being reinvigorated or being overwhelmed with the loss of skill.

I do understand how breaks can help but I also know myself well enough that I can turn 1 day into 90 days pretty easy so I sort of operate out of fear and try to to break too much.

Life seams to give me my breaks, grandkids and the like.

I have also seen value in just pushing through creative blocks and ruts and I personally feel more consistent because of it. I use to rely on the wind? Or whatever to blow something my way. Now if I continue to practice the wind still comes but I have also banked some more valuable practice.

I know I sound like an idiot but if you met me in real life you would probably lean more towards Iā€™m just a nit wit.

So itā€™s all good

Iā€™ve found exactly the same thing, especially more recently now my technique is really coming on. I went a week or two without playing at one point, and found my technique came back within one day better than ever. For me, I feel itā€™s down to a fresh perspective and awareness of the subtle mechanics taking place when I play.

Rick Graham has definitely commented on taking time away from the guitar in the past a number of times.

Iā€™ve taken the past two weeks off completely, which is very awkward for me. I might push it to 3 or even 4 weeks, but Iā€™m not sure yet. Iā€™ve been drilling technique hardcore for the better part of two years now, so Iā€™m curious to see what this will do.

I donā€™t think itā€™s possible for me to get any faster with alternate picking (200-220 16th notes or sextuplet equivalents, 240+ right hand alone) but I need to see for myself if technical refinement is optimized when you stop cramming repetitions in.

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Wow Iā€™d love to hear what you find.

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obviously there is going to be a point of diminishing returns with time off just as there is with the practice itself

2 weeks off is a fair amount. I know there are no ā€œrulesā€ for this type of thing but id think it would be similar to more physical stuff like weightlifting.

Evidently the way the Soviets did it was to program most of their training into 4 week blocks and in general it would be set up where every 4th week would be an easier week. That 4th week would be either, or both, less total volume, and/or lighter weights.

Then maybe after several of those 4 week cycles theyd take a little bit longer of a break. of course they programmed this so that they would ā€œpeakā€ for important competitions and then naturally take a break right afterward. Then at the ā€œendā€ of their season each year they might have a total 2-4 week break.

of course WITHIN each and every 4 week cycle there was variation built in. harder days, easier days etc.

This was all based upon the fact that the body needs to be pushed hard to stimulate adaptationā€¦but also the fact that fatigue builds up over time and must be taken into consideration.

So long story short, I can see a similar thing being good for us guitarists. just off the top of my head something like this:

3 hard weeks followed by one ā€œeasierā€ week.
After 3 months take a few days off or up to a week off
At or around the 6th month mark either take a week or possibly 10ish days off but maybe not all the way off. Just cut way back etc.
End of the year, maybe holiday season. Take a longer 2 weekish break

The idea being that we can work harder and more focused when we know we have breaks coming. We work WITH the bodys natural tendencies

Also we can plan areas of focus to go with these ā€œ3 hard weeks, 1 easy weekā€ cycles. Work a few areas hard, take a break, come back and work on something different

Personally I dunno if anything longer than a 2 week break makes any sense. Also I dont think id personally take 2 weeks totally off. Id probably at least limber up a bit here and there.

Peace, JJ

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