Vai Inspired Ascending Alternate-picked run

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#141

Idk if you like Jason Becker at all, but thats who I copied. I don’t have hands like him, but his picking style works well for me. You can see him anchoring with the pinky.

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I think your picking is very close just with less thumb movement and no anchor.
I posted about his technique here if you’re interested. I found it helps a bunch. I also put a lot of work into EVH’s way of picking and it’s really useful to switch between styles. And I do a Gypsy jazz/Marty Friedman style picking.
I’ve found that even tho it takes a long time to develop these different styles, it’s only helped me as I try to improve. I don’t think there is a one style fits all type thing. Certain EVH songs for example only really flow with his middle finger technique. The intro to Women in Love is one of those that need his technique to get the sound right. If I try to play this with the index finger it’s just akward as the weight of the hand digs into the strings too much and the palm muting is less smooth.

From experience I can definitely say putting work into different picking technique has helped me. I would think Troy has experienced that same thing, as he’s really put serious work into loads of styles. And as we all know, Troy plays awesome :grin:

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#142

I don’t think you really need to change much, but the issue is that - and this is the part that sucks but may be necessary - is that it takes time and may feel like a regression at first. This makes it all the more frustrating and the the reason why most people will be least likely to see the necessary changes all the way through.

The truth is, that any change you make, be it big or small, are going to seem unnatural at first and generally a pain in the ass.

The biggest things I see

  1. where you are picking and where you are placing your hand. Whether or not you are anchored is a personal choice. I choose to sometimes very lightly with my fingers and with my palm lightly about where the strings come out of the guitar. IMHO, This somewhat forces a more focused range of motion without severely restricting what you need for speed.

Ideally this puts your pick about where the middle pickup is on your strat, or a little before. Picking here gives good balance between string resistance and pick resistance, and tone, where you get a good attack, and the pick bounces over the string because there is a bit more string tension there than near the neck. But it’s not so sharp sounding as picking closer to where the string breaks over the bridge saddles for example. It also may be good to focus on hitting the string with just the tip of the pick regardless of how much of the pick is sticking out. This has more to do with dynamics and control.

  1. The wrist motion you use is good, but you may want to focus it a bit more or just add a few tweaks. From the angle you shoot at, and the lighting it’s a little hard to see, but it looks like strict wrist translation. If you attempt to trade some of that translation for just a slight more rotation movement instead making your picking path a bit more elliptical and then use the muscle that connects the thumb to the wrist to pick up some of the fine movements, not so much rocking the pick angle back and forth with thumb and index finger but more so a tracing, drawing, scribbling, motion, That will do it. Imagine when your picking the strings, that the pick tip is like a mix between a record needle bouncing in the grooves and small scribbling on a piece of paper.
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#143

Well this is great guys, thanks so much !

Now I have some things to try and work on.

My problem is that I expect too much of myself, I expect myself to pick the guitar up and be able to play anything using my same old motion and of course it never works out like that so I get upset and think I’m useless.

Seems like you are both on the same vein with the advice about the thumb, and yes @WhammyStarScream I always loved Jason Becker, I bought Cacophony through mail order from the US back in 1990, I think I still have it somewhere, and I always thought his picking was great.

I was thinking if getting a Magnet might help me to analyse and improve things, maybe I will rig up a DIY version with some tape and vice grips to see.

Anyway, thanks again, I will continue to post and hopefully work towards some improvements.

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#144

These picks I posted about might help with using the thumb a bit.

Idk if thats what you’re talking about @Fossegrim ?
I find the thumb n index movement to help a lot with picking. From what I’ve learnt many people call it Sarod picking? It’s been posted about on this forum too. Whatever it’s commonly called, I find it very useful.

#145

@WhammyStarScream not so much the actual pick though that may help too. When I’m home in a little bit I can elaborate a little more maybe via camera phone. It’s not so much a circular rocking back and forth with the thumb and index as it’s a concentrated oscillation or shake there. It’s almost like using only half of the back and forth pure wrist translation in your picture.

#146

I post that pick as it is really useful for developing and feeling the thumb and index picking style. And in general removing your feeling of holding a pick due to less surface area so you can focus on the hand better.

If you can post a video about it that would be great as your picking was awesome in the last video. All this stuff helps me learn a lot

#147

One more addendum: After what was posted is good and going then it’s really a matter of left hand work and two hand synchronization. Otherwise what ever you gain with your picking hand is not very useful.

Because really, who gives a shit if your right hand can pick 20nps when your left hand can only react to 11nps.

#148

I posted about this before, but “pretending” to hold a pick and using the tip of my index finger to brush the string was something I used to do to get a feel on picking without having to focus on the pick grip.

I feel like I use a decent amount of thumb and index finger movement, and it’s just a jazz III shaped pick. I’m not sure a smaller pick would be more conducive, but it doesn’t hurt to try!

#149

@WhammyStarScream
The only picture I saw in there was the one with the hands translation and rotation diagram

#150

I think that’s really just preference. I find with the smaller jazz iii, They tend to put a lot more strain on my first index finger joint where I have to hold them. Puts a bit more stress on the joint when I impact the string. I prefer the larger ultex versions.

#151

In your picking I definitely see a lot of thumb and index. (combined with wrist and rotation) And you do it incredibly well.
In my experience a smaller pick does exactly what you’re basicly saying, removes the pick (kind of) and lets you feel what your hand is doing.

@Fossegrim I posted a picture of the pick and a video of one of mine, is it not there?

The reason I mention these small picks is for practice purposes, not preformance. I agree with you @Fossegrim I find a bigger pick better for preformance. But that is different from practice, there are many things I do in practice to learn better that I’d not do in a preformance setting. Like a sprinter wouldn’t drag a tire behind him in an actual competition :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

#152

@Fossegrim sync is a problem for me for sure, and I had a feeling you were going to say that, I was waiting for you to say it all week haha.

A big problem I have is coordinating my ring and pinky fingers on the left hand. Always had that problem, which is why I always preferred to play 3NPS 1, 2, 4 licks and not 1, 3, 4 if you see what I mean. The Yngwie 6s and 4s therefore are a problem.

I don’t know if I can ever fix it, I’ve tried just practicing over and over to try and build up strength and coordination but it doesn’t seem to improve. Also of course it probably won’t improve now because of my arthritis.

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#153

Have you ever tried the supplement NAC? Arthritis is excessive inflammation of the joints? And over time builds up into actual calcification right? I’ve not done much research into it as I don’t have it myself, yet… Tho perhaps it may help.

If you’re dealing with arthritis then the less movement you make in a single joint is bound to help. I apologize If I’m being ignorent as I’ve not had to deal with it yet. I have had to deal with knee popping tho and a supplement I looked into was hyaluronic acid. Apparently it can help lubricate the joints…

#154

Can you link it? I’d like to read.

#155

@WhammyStarScream can you quote what you’re replying to? It’s not letting me click it!

Interesting that you see rotation, I always felt some kind of rotation but was unsure.

#156

“I posted about this before, but “pretending” to hold a pick and using the tip of my index finger to brush the string was something I used to do to get a feel on picking without having to focus on the pick grip.”

This :grin:

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#157

Yes it’s inflammation of the joints and nodules can develop on the bones around the joints, the cartilidge in the joints can deteriorate too,
I have heard of NAC but not tried it. Although I am relatively young to have it, apparently a lot of guitarists get it, if they haven’t been looking after themselves that is, which I am guilly of for sure.

The good news is it has improved since I started taking supplements, Krill Oil, Magnesium, Curcumin and been eating more veg.

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#158

@WhammyStarScream I’m looking for the post with no luck. Honestly it just says something very similar: use the tip of your index finger as a pick and just brush the strings. You could also use the side of you thumb, maybe even your middle finger if you are doing some kind of EVH grip. The goal is to work on a picking motion without worrying about the grip, or feeling the the muscular tension of holding a pick.

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#159

I’ll try that. Did you go slow or fast? Your picking on the run is so fast, do you practice with your index at similar speeds?

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#160

Yeah it’s basically the same thing people on this forum do (trem one note as fast as you can), but I’ve never tried to actually play something that way.