Avoiding Downstrokes

Playing Technique
#1

Hay Troy.I just joined …been dying to ask you some things! First thing you kick ass! The main question I have is how in the hell do I stop always landing on a down stroke when practicing runs licks ? Because a
lot of times when I push my self to play faster …I always land on a down stroke whats the best way to break this bad habit? Thanks .

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Solving 3nps Fours with One-Way Pickslanting
#2

Not sure what you’re asking here. If this is a separate question from the “fours” solutions, I recommend starting a new thread with that - and videos always help! Put up a clip in “Technique Critique” demonstrating the problem and we’ll take a look.

Also, make sure to check out the live broadcast on picking motion first because it is the the first step in getting your motions sorted out:

https://troygrady.com/channels/talking-the-code/introduction-to-picking-motion/

#3

Ok sorry! I’m a little slow sometimes. What I think you are asking - correct me if I’m wrong - is how to do you avoid having a string change occur after a downstroke.

If that’s the case, the answers are:

  1. There’s nothing wrong with downstroke string changes - that is what upward pickslanting, and other methods, are for!

  2. Everything is memorized, even improvisation. That’s how improvisation works at the mechanical level. The proper movement must be used for the kind of string change you want to make. I know it looks like great improvisers are just winging it and somehow it works out, but that’s not actually what is happening. All their movements are memorized, right down to the level of individual pickstrokes. Those memorized movements are then connected together into phrases, and so on. It’s an illusion! Only once you have done all this work can you “wing it”, and expect it to work out - it will feel like “improv” but at some level you will be playing back pre-recorded movements. The better you can do this, the more “improv” you will sound.

In our various lessons and seminars, we spend hours and hours talking about the different kinds of string changes you can make, the hand movements required for these, and outlining which phrases work with those kinds of string changes, and so on.

The “getting started” sequence here is definitely to sort out your picking motion first with the live broadcast I’ve linked to.

Then you can check out the Pickslanting Primer and work through which phrases work with which kind of physical movements. Try to keep an open mind. You’re not here to learn “downward pickslanting” or any other specific technique. You’re here to learn movements that work - whichever ones you are currently best at.

Thanks for signing up and good luck!

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#4

Ok … When i"m playing fast runs like 3 nps or 6 nps i’m always hiting a down stroke at the last note when its supose to be an up stroke …somewhere im hiting notes 2 times or whatever but its going by to fast i just dont know where im going wrong … If i do it at slow tempo im fine …but if i try to speed it up my brain always wants to land on a down strokee… Maybe because my im so use to playing with pulloffs and playing satriani for years.

#5

That’s probably some kind of chunk fragments, happens to me too from time to time too but for upstrokes (I use six note patterns a lot).
For me works best stepping with the foot and repeat it a couple of times.

#6

Thanks. I will try that …does this happen to you To when you play runs from low to high or high to low … Always landing on a down stroke…? Maybe its a timming thing.

#7

Yes just the same as for you, only fast.
When you play fast your brain does not execute every single movement anymore, instead it groups together things and takes as a single ‘command’. That’s called chunking.
So if you did things a lot in the past, chances are high that at some point they interfere with new things.
The last note is pretty often high accented, so probably focusing on that note triggers a chunk ending on a downstroke for you. To enable that something is changed on the way there.

Using the foot forces you to focus on accents and rhythm and you can speed it up and down as you need and (at least for me) the strokes on beat then come out correctly.

I’m not sure if there are better methods, for me that does the job pretty well.
… and always glad when i can help :grinning:

EDIT:
Not sure if this is true, but on rethinking, my guess is that there might be chunks for both hands isolated and chunks that combine both.
So for better understanding, focusing on the rhythm might help to use the ‘isolated’ chunks, or build them.

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#8

Hey there,
What kind of patterns do you use?
It should come quite easily if you are playing fours or sixes (unless you maybe repeat the same stroke twice?) Anyways, it would be quite helpful to see a video of your playing, to be able to see what’s causing your problem. You mentioned that your problem occurs when pushing yourself to play faster; maybe you could practice it slightly slower to gain more control of what stroke you finish on, and when you get used to this, speed it up gradually, and don’t push yourself too much. Maybe try some good old metronome practice, or as @theGuyFromGermany said, use your foot to help you synchronize yourself better.

#9

Hay Thanks for joining inn! the patterns I use that it happens the most are the sixes and fours , It never fails if I try to keep up with players like troy or Paul Gilbert for some reason when I finish the phrasing 9 out of 10 times I’m landing on a down stroke ,but it seems like I’m on time when playing along , Than they show you slow mo and again I’m missing up strokes along the way .

#10

Hi troy would love to get ur opinion on my down rest stroke it always lands futher down … Is it because im striking to hard ? Thanks great work and site by the way! Worth every penny!

Is this DWPS correctly please?
#11

Hey, I moved this post FYI as I think you’re referring to the same question as earlier in this topic? As Troy mentioned above, the best thing to do for getting more specific feedback on this is make a new #technique-critique post with video so we can take a look! You can browse others’ #technique-critique posts for examples, and when you create a new post in that category a template will appear in the composer window with some guidelines for how to film and upload. Let us know if you have further questions on how that works :slight_smile: