Can't Play with Rhythm - Going Back to Basics!

Playing Technique
#1

Hi there,

I’ve been playing guitar for many years but have never really progressed, unfortunately. I watched a recording of myself playing yesterday and realized that I am never playing on time of the beat. (When playing, I always thought that I was playing on time, but a playback has proven it to be wrong!)

For instance, when I alternate pick a scale - say 4 beats per measure, 4 notes per beat - I am always playing ahead of the note. I worked hard all day yesterday to overcome this, and although I was initially off by 1/16 note, I am still off by a beat of 1/64. This is happening even when the tempo is set to something low like 110 bpm.

My picking is also not smooth - my downstroke is stronger than my upstroke, which makes the entire phrase sound uneven.

I’ve always wanted to be able to pick faster - hence the reason why I bought and downloaded cracking the code series, etc. - but before I even come remotely close to being able to do all of this, I am back to square one and need to be able to pick on time. Sigh. I completely lack rhythm at this point. I always end up playing ahead of the note, and I think this is because I have always wanted to be a fast shredder and my mind probably keeps telling me to play faster and faster, even faster than the beat.

I guess the best remedy for this is to keep playing with the metronome, but does anybody have any good ways to fix this “basic” issue which has been hindering me for all of these years from becoming a decent player? For some reason I have been finding this very difficult…

Thanks.

Martin

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#2

I have exactly the same story and problem, except that I’ve noticed it quite a long time ago – I make musical arrangements as a job and often record my playing on guitar, bass and few other instruments for use in an arrangement. I tend to play ahead of the beat not only on guitar, but on any instrument (flute, for instance), which may mean that there’s some kind of psychological/perceptual issue (rather than technical). This playing ahead seems to be common problem. I think I’ve heard it on some commercial records. I’ve definitely heard it on some Joe Stump tunes. Also check Jimmy Page’s solo on “Hot Dog” :laughing:

I try to correct it with playing along with metronome, sometimes at really slow tempos. It’s more about concentration – you have to “feel” the tempo and listen carefully to every not you play. If you succeed, at some point metronome click just “disappears” because you play notes at exactly the same time.

One technique which is quite evident but it eluded me for years until a fellow guitar player pointed me to it recently – interpret metronome clicks as 2nd and 4th beats of a measure (rather that 1st and 3rd). I guess it helps to “feel” strong beats better.

Also I think it helps to play not only with metronome, but with real music, also listening to your playing carefully. (Sometimes playing sounds good even if it’s slightly out of rhythm grid – actually BECAUSE of it). Just simple parts along with playalong tracks. No improvising maybe, just well-known phrases and riffs, which you enjoy playing. (I’ve noticed that when I improvise, the tendency to play ahead of the beat becomes a lot more evident.)

I’ve found some useful (I hope so) advice on this problem here:

And metronome on this site is also quite useful:

One more thing – although I said above about “listening carefully to every note”, for smaller note durations/faster tempos chunking should be used. Like if you play your 16ths at 110 bpm, you actually should pay close attention only to the 16th note which overlaps a metronome click, trying to make this single note dead on the beat, and the rest three notes will follow, until the next click.

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#3

Thanks for your feedback, Alex.

I was keeping the “chunking” concept in mind when playing as well. At a slower tempo like 110 bpm, I think because I am so focused on the first “beep” of the metronome in 4/4 signature, only my first 1/16 note is somewhat in sync and the rest of the notes are completely off.

I guess I need to sing along to every beat and try to keep rhythm until it becomes natural to me.

#4

Try to clap as the guy at studybass.com suggests :slight_smile: Honestly I haven’t tried this method, I’m curious if it works.

#5

Ya, just read through it. I will give it a try. Thanks again for your time :wink:

#6

I work on my timing with the vanishing metronome trick like @Alexander mentioned. It’s different from regular metronome practice in that you’re playing only one note most of the time.

Start with your metronome set to 60 bpm. Play one note on each click making sure that the note is the same volume with up and down strokes. If you’re right on the beat the sound of the click will go away and you’ll only hear your guitar. When you can make the click disappear consistently play a short scale pattern. If you can make the click disappear for most of the scale you’re ready to move up the tempo a few bpm. Remember that speed is not the goal, the goal is playing in the pocket. I rarely go above 8th notes at 120bpm with this exercise.

Do it every day for a few minutes before starting regular metronome exercises. When you can lock in quickly and consistently then once or twice a week is good to maintain timing. At that point intentionally playing behind or ahead of the beat comes easily.

Here’s a good video going over the technique:
5’ Guitar Exercise: The Disappearing Metronome - JustinGuitar

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#7

Do you notice progress in your timing after doing such exercises? (I hope the answer is yes)

#8

Learn drum tracks on the guitar and play them.

#9

Definitely yes. You’ll feel it even if you do it for only a minute before regular metronome practice. I think what’s happening is that it forces your ears and hands to become more attenuated to the beat so it’s easier to tell if you’re rushing or dragging. It really helps me with not accenting every string change and not having 3 note-per-string runs always sounding like triplets.
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#10

I’m so glad to see someone else using this method!

I’d take it one further though—instead of playing a note, strum muted strings. Now there’s no way for even the slightest sustain to convince you that you’re burying the click when you’re actually rushing.

The other exercise I really love is to record short phrases into a DAW and view the waveforms in relation to the grid. We’re such visual creatures that it really helps reprogram your ears to hear the beat in the proper place.

Both of those exercises and a slew of others in a free Metronome Boot Camp that I do.

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#11

YES!

Stewart Copeland rushes and Sting drags, but they sound magical together.

AC/DC’s rhythmic pushes are kind of lazy & late, but it rocks so hard.

Questlove and Chris Dave can both play drum machine parts where (for example) the hi hats rush but the snare drags.

My favorite drummer here in Chicago has a totally fluid time feel and a band that covers a different act each month, and he’ll change his feel to sound alarmingly like the band he’s covering.

It’s super cool to play a theatre gig when a sub drummer or bassist is in, because it’ll be exactly the same as it was for the last however many weeks—same song, same part, same tempo, same instrument, same mics, same everything all the way to your in-ears, but… it’ll sound totally different.

Feel is one of those things that pros talk about a ton but isn’t on the radar of most hobbyists.

#12

I watched a recording of myself playing yesterday

Keep doing this, just record yourself playing a little bit every session and listen back critically. You need the feedback loop.

Misha Mansoor from Periphery says that this was a huge part of his guitar learning. He would just record riffs and cover songs into a DAW every day, eventually double/quad tracking them with drum machines and click tracks and it forced him to tighten up his playing.

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#13

I’m curious about one thing: has the drummer in any of the bands you’ve played in mentioned that you have this problem or did they not notice it either? You say that you realized this yesterday when you recorded yourself and then played the recoding so it seems that no drummer you’ve ever played with has pointed out this issue. I can’t stress enough the importance of having a good drummer in your band. He will tell you when you’re making this mistake and he will help you overcome this problem. The practice you do alone is necessary for developing an efficient picking technique but the practice you do alone only takes you so far. Then it’s your band practices along with the shows your band plays that are going to give you the type of practice and the type of experience which cannot be gotten any other way and that type of practice and experience will help you in ways that are invaluable.

If you don’t currently have a band, the next best thing is to record yourself while playing along to a drum machine and then listening back to it. If you don’t have a drummer or a drum machine I strongly advise you invest in a drum machine. I think you’ll find the benefits you get from it will be well worth the money you spend.

As for your downstroke being stronger than your upstroke, you can improve the power of your upstroke. Just remember that the upstroke will never sound exactly the same as the downstroke. That’s why rhythm guitarists like James Hetfield play riffs using exclusively downstrokes whenever possible - because the downstroke will always be the stronger and better sounding of the two.

#14

Thanks for your feedback. The truth is, I’ve never played in a band nor with a drummer! I do have DAW, so my next move is to setup a drum machine and play back, etc. :wink:

#15

Oh, you’ve never played with a drummer. That explains why you only just realized you had this timing problem. I would suggest you get a band together and only partially because then you get get feedback from the band on your timing. The other reason I suggest getting in a band or putting a band together is because it’s a lot of fun!

In the meantime, I think your plan to set up a drum machine and play back is a very smart plan and should help you with your problem. Good luck with everything! :slight_smile: