Constraints on picking, in order: Frequency, Depth, then Slop

Playing Technique
#1

I think this is right, but let me check with you. In order of importance:

  1. Frequency (Critical). The pick must move back-and-forth at an exact rate, under the control of the metronome. Jitter in each stroke must be kept to a minimum, or the player will be recognized as being off the beat.

  2. Depth (Important). The pick must hit the string at the right “depth” (does Troy have a term for this?). If the pick is too high, it can miss the string entirely, and if it is too low it can hit another string by accident. Uneven depth will change the feel of the stroke and make uniformity difficult, so I suspect that reasonable uniformity in depth is important. Under a separate thread I suggested that the best way to understand depth is to listen to the unplugged guitar volume in addition to trying to feel the string, I’m not sure if that’s true, but I would bet it is.

  3. Slop (irrelevant). I think that it doesn’t matter much how the pick ends a stroke. If it goes too far getting trapped, that’s a harmless rest stroke. If it goes too far getting free, it’s just a little higher.

So, frequency is king, and depth is queen. I think that people suggeting that strokes have to be short are mistaken. Right or wrong? :thinking:

1 Like
#2

im guessing there are different approaches and those things you list affect each other in different ways. They are inTERdependent

Different personalities will approach guitar learning in different ways

Take a guy with a fast and aggressive personality. He is ready to go fast NOW!! Not tomorrow. He isnt worried about anything being “correct”…he just wants to rock out. So maybe he grips a little tighter, picks a little harder, and picking depth doesnt affect him as much. He isnt really the type to plug away for hours with a metronome. Slop? He couldnt care less. He is all about athleticism. You can more clearly see what he is doing because everything is a bit “bigger” (Zakk Wylde maybe??)

His buddy is more of the calm, intellectual type. He doesnt mind taking time to work on things slowly. he wants to be “correct” lol. So he focuses a lot on accuracy and picking depth and he slowly works things up with a metronome. This guy, with his millions of “correct” repetitions, aint gonna have much “slop” lol. His slanting and other movements are a bit harder to see since everything is a bit “smaller” and more precise. (Rick Graham?)

I wouldnt say either of them is right or wrong, They just do things according to their natures

#3

I believe that they must be in that order, with no choices.

If the frequency is wrong, the music will sound terrible, that’s why it is #1: Other people will be able to tell that something is wrong with the music.

If the depth is wrong, playing will be difficult and error-prone, but it might be possible to hide this from the listener; this is why depth is #2.

Finally slop (does Troy have a term for this?) is not important at all, and anybody trying to minimize slop is wasting their time, I believe, becaues it is harmless. (People trying to reduce slop are wasting their time because they have to be able to support travel over several string spacings at the minimum in order to be able to change strings.)

Or at leats that’s what I’ve convinced myself of at the moment, alhough I could certainly be wrong. :grinning:

1 Like
#4

All three of tgese would result in slop as far as I am concerned and
Why would you think I couldn’t hear it
No matter what the cause.

I hate the internet because I know
That sounds argumentative and I’m
More confused than angry. Lol

Its like trying to have a ‘most important’ link in a chain.

It all matters

Fwiw
I consider slop anything you don’t mean to do/lack of control

1 Like
#5

I think by “slop” he just means the pick continues on way past the point where it picks the string…as opposed to being super precise

I know that Troy made some comments at different times about the size of the picking motion and that it doesnt need to be super precise per se. At least not ALL the time for ALL styles and types of licks etc.

That being said I have a feeling his comments can be taken out of context etc.

If we REALLY want to quantify things we can start looking at clips of the best players in the world and we can see how much “slop” or excess picking motion we find. I have a feeling we wont find all that much lol. I think in most cases we will find pretty small movements unless they are playing at slower speeds

not a super close up but we can see the idea. Not a trace of slop to be found in this guy

#6

If by ‘slop’ you mean how far the pick travels past the pickstroke (both sides) I don’t think it has to do with precision, but more with how much strength you put in the stroke in the first place, as well has how deep vs shallow stroke is.

Basically putting a fair amount of strength combined with a shallow attack and your pick will travel far. You might still achieve a ‘light touch’, even if you push/pull hard provided the attack is shallow enough. I do play a lot of acoustic guitar and this is to me what gives the best result tone-wise an wrt articulation. Also see how hard Gypsy players play, often with lots of ‘slop’. That doesn’t hinder precision.

The worse to me, for speed, tone, articulation, ‘pulse’, whatever … would be the opposite i.e. a wimpy stroke with a lot of depth.

1 Like
#7

Yes, exactly.

By the way, I wasn’t familiar with Rick Graham, he’s clearly a great player!

1 Like