Haven’t seen that video but Troy talks about pick depth in his pick slanting primer from 11:40 onward for a bit:
Maybe things have changed since the primer was made four years ago, I’lll watch the new one to see what he says.
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Saw the video you linked, my takeaway is that he’s saying picking “shallower” is not the solution for proper escape mechanics; I wouldn’t take that as “picking depth is not something to consider”. That being said, I’m hoping @Troy chimes in, as I’m curious what he has to say.
In the video I linked, at 15:35, @Troy says "if I can’t tell the difference between this… " and goes on to play a few notes with very heavy attack, then smoother notes afterwards, saying “I just want it to sound good and I want the resistance to feel appropriate.”
In the videos that OP @RobertFlores has posted, many notes sound like the attack is too much, or if I were to paraphrase @Troy, the resistance does not sound appropriate.
Again, this is just based on my personal experience, sample size 1. To recreate that kind of attack, I would have to increase my pick depth which in turn would pretty much break my alternate picking.
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This sounds like a case of everyone being correct. Yes pick attack is important and I modultate by feel without ever thinking about pick attack specifically. No, it’s not a substitute for actually doing the right motion. No, trying to adjust “pick depth” was not ever (for me) the key to solving a picking problem. That has always boiled down to something about the motion that I didn’t know how to do. Take this with a grain of salt since again this is N=1 sample size and I never personally thought about pick depth. So it’s possible that pick depth played more of a role in challenges I’ve had that I’m giving it credit for. If it has, I’m not aware of it.
In the case of Robert’s clips that appear bouncy, whether or not there is a pick depth issue, it’s clear there are motion issues related to bouncyness / inefficiency so that’s really the main problem with this motion, and what I would solve first.
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I watched the first 21 seconds of this slow motion clip and it looks like the upstroke string changes are clean and not swiping most of the time. It’s mainly the downstroke string changes that swipe. When you perform the clean upstroke string changes, you’re also changing your arm position slightly to be more supinated, i.e. pinky heel anchor. This is the correct arm position and motion for “3:00” motion, aka deviation wrist motion, used for USX. This is Mike Stern-style USX motion. This is the best, smoothest, cleanest, and most efficient picking motion I’ve seen you do in any of these clips. High five all around.
So now you have something you can work with. Let’s try not to get all hung up on Steve Morse stuff. Let’s get the USX motion happening on USX phrases to just really cement what it feels like when done correctly. Make no mistake, this requires work. You play the stuff fast, and see if you can notice when it feels clean. You may have to tinker with the arm position or some other aspect of the motion to get that “aha it’s clean” feeling. But since you’re already doing it, you know it’s already there. You just have to be able to recognize by feel which setup causes this, and learn to create it on command without needing to check it with a camera.
Can we make that the project for the next week or two or however long it takes? I’d like to see some USX phrases being played smoothly and cleanly, and I think that would be a nice tangible step forward here. Plenty of cool patterns and lines you can play.
We can address other escapes and how to do them once you have a firm platform of something reliable you can stand on.
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If you already have a handle on USX, what would be the next step if you’re having issues with DSX movements when trying to crosspick?
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I wouldn’t think of it just filling in the other half, i.e. the missing motion (the other escape) that you don’t yet have. I think of it as a process. You choose a phrase and try to play it at fast enough tempo where efficiency would be required, 150bpm or something if we’re doing bluegrass type stuff or jazz stuff. Then you look at it and see if it’s actually working. Are the motions correct, or incorrect? If they’re wrong, you have to keep experimenting until you do it right at least once, even if by accident.
To be clear, when I say correct I don’t necessarily mean every note is correct. But the motions need to at least look correct. You need to see the pick or hand or arm doing what you want it to do, which in this case probably means escaping — or at least trying to! Even if it’s missing the string or the fretting is wrong or the timing is wrong. That’s ok. But you have to be basically doing it. You can’t clean up something that’s “wrong” in the sense of not making the right escape You can clean up a correct escape motion that was just aimed wrong, or timed wrong.
As far as I know, there is really no substitute for getting it right at least once at “normal” speed. This is the only way that has worked for me in learning any technique. It’s always an accidental “hey what was that” which happens while winging it. I don’t know any way of skipping that step. As you’ve pointed out, trying to think your way into correct motions at slower speed doesn’t seem to work.
I like to see the glass half full. I may spend a lot of time on and off trying to figure something out. But I’d rather do that than have to do the old fashioned way of grinding the metronome up 5bpm every day. They both take time. But one is boring (to me) and the other is more fun and exploratory.
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I think I’ve got USX stuff down pretty well. It’s really just downstrokes that I still need to figure out badly to unlock my playing.
Can’t think of a better example of USX than 2nps stiuff. So here’s some noodling at normal speed video.
and here’s the slowmo.
