Hi guys,
I’m looking at potentially purchasing one of these very soon.
Colours are irrelevant but I am looking for an HSS version and maple fretboard.
Going to test them next weekend but looking forward to hearing your thoughts I have you have tried them before or have had the same dilemma.
Thanks!
Haven’t played either, but from specs:
I think a big factor is simply whether you like the jack placement on the Fender. Some people love it, some people hate it.
Knob placement might also be something to consider, though it’s also one of the easiest things to modify.
Bridge on the Ibanez is nicer, unless you specifically have a personal preference for two-point Fender bridges.
The heel joint on the Ibanez looks very nice. I think heel joint concerns sometimes get blown out of proportion, but if it’s something that matters to you, you’ll probably like the Ibanez better.
Pickups are a matter of taste, so whichever floats your boat in that department.
If you’re ever thinking of selling, there’s probably more used demand for the Fender.
I think both guitars are overpriced for what they are, but if you’re choosing between these two, those are my main thoughts beyond the simple matter of “which one feels and sounds better to you?” If it were me, I’d get a Squier and replace the nut and (if necessary) the pickups.
Thank you, I am a bit of a spec guy so it makes senses to compare them, although the ultimate test will be whether I get the mojo or not with them.
Is this serious? I can’t make out whether you’re being sarcastic here. I am a terrible guitar player so a better guitar will not make me better, but I can feel a difference between a £200 guitar and a £1000 axe, quality of build, pickups, electronics, hardware, etc.
What is not overpriced in your view?
Completely.
But I’m not going to shit on somebody for choosing a guitar that makes them happy. The part below is going to sound like a rant, but it’s less directed at you, and more an expression of my gripe with how guitars are marketed. It gets long. I hope you find the guitar that’s right for you, regardless.
Super short answer to “what is not overpriced in my view?” Well, I think solid body guitars are overpriced in general, but you can often find differences that I could find justifiable up to around USD$700. And if we start talking solid-body guitar with locking tremolo, I’d max out at Charvel So-Cal/San Dimas, or Ibanez Genesis, so for that about USD$1000.
It partly comes down to what a person values in a guitar. Also my cutoff would be different depending on the category of guitar. But for a classic, solid body Strat style guitar with a non-locking bridge? I can tell the difference between a USD$300 Strat and a USD$1500 Strat, but those differences generally won’t make a difference to how well I’ll be able to play on it, or how much I’ll enjoy it (with the exception of whether I specifically hate the pickups on a cheap guitar, but I can do a full pickup replacement that will suit my taste for max of about $300 if I have to). In practice I like HSS or HH guitars, and based on what I like to play, the only pickup I’ve ever felt the need to replace on any guitar is the bridge humbucker, and the usual suspects from Seymour Duncan and Dimarzio are about $100 each. Tuners are only an issue if the stock ones are really bad, and if they have to be replaced you’re talking another $100 for Sperzel or equivalent. I like a TUSQ XL nut, and that’s around USD$10. Switches, potentiometers and capacitors are usually fine on all but the cheapest of cheap guitars, but high-quality replacements can be bought cheap from places like mouser.com.
There was a time when the necks and bodies on cheap guitars were frequently problematic, but those days are mostly gone. If you’re an experienced player who can inspect a guitar before you buy it, it’s not hard to find a Squier Bullet that can be made into a beast with a nut replacement, a setup, and a small amount of fretwork. Unfortunately, they’ve started only selling them new as hardtails. I’ve seen Bullets and Affinitys that shouldn’t have been allowed to leave the factory (usually due to neck pocket problems, or incorrect bridge placement), but nowadays those are the exception rather than the norm.
Yamaha has slipped from where they once were on price/performance, but they are still generally the best by that measure. I’ve also had good experiences buying low-end Jay Tursers for friends and family. The only widely available cheap strat I’ve stumbled across lately that I really disliked was the newish ultra-cheap Kramer Focus from Gibson. Some people refuse to buy any guitar made in China, but many made in China guitars are fine. Main issue with buying a guitar made in China, Indonesia, or South Korea is if you have moral concerns about the working conditions in the factories.
For an acoustic or a hollow-body electric, we’re talking about a whole different ballgame. And for guitars with locking tremolos, differences in bridge quality have more practical importance than for non-locking ones, and there are considerations about whether the guitar is a candidate for a drop-in bridge replacement.
But a strat with a non-locking two-point or six-screw trem? Today it’s basically like buying a toaster. Does it make toast? Great, you’re good to go. Are some toasters “nicer” than others. Sure. Does the toast taste any different? Nope. Now, I wouldn’t buy a toaster unless it had a pull-out tray for dumping the crumbs, and not all of them do, but that’s about the only “dealbreaker” I can think of, apart from it being literally defective. Other people might care more than I do about something like “the handle on the spring lever of this toaster feels too wiggly”, and that’s up to them. But for me, I wouldn’t be willing to pay triple the price over that sort of thing.
Interesting comparison, for a couple reasons.
My first love was a Strat, I’ve owned that guitar for coming up on 24 years, have modded the hell out of it, and love that guitar to pieces. And, I’ve moved on a bit since, but I was an Ibanez player almost exclusively for more than a decade.
These are both “strat style” guitars, but they have less in common than they might seem to at a glance.
The Ibanez AZ is basically their take on a Suhr Modern, and isn’t really their traditional RG style superstrat. It will have a thicker-than-typical neck for an Ibanez, but probably still thinner than average and I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a hair thinner than that Fender.
That Fender, meanwhile, is just an upgraded, modified Strat. Which, I like strats.
The big spec differences, to me, are (ignoring neck carve, which I can’t really speak to without playing both back to back):
Either of these is probably capable of being a great guitar, and while I haven’t played any new Ibanez guitars in a long while, for a while now Fenders have really impressed me off the rack - idiosyncratic factors in the specific guitar you play will probably be important here, if the Fender is great but the AZ is acoustially kinda a dud, that’ll make your mind up for you, I suspect.
Two suggestions, though, if you want to open your mind to someting else - one more expensive one less.
Like I said, the AZ is basically Ibanez’s take on a Suhr Modern. If you don’t mind lighting hundred-euro bills on fire, Fender’s QC has been pretty good for a while now, but I’ve never played a Suhr that wasn’t at least pretty sweet, and the best ones have been some of the best guitars I’ve ever played - I swear my Modern 6 is alive. If there’s any way you can play one, you’ll probably come close to doubling the cost, but if nothing else it’ll help you put the AZ into context.
I own two Strats. One is the '97 American Standard I bought new more than two decades ago and will go to the grave with me. The other is a… I think it’s a 2014 American Standard body, 2012 or 14 American Deluxe neck, with a set of Suhr piclkups (they make spectacular singlecoils, their ML Standards are the best I’ve played and only a couple bucks more expensive than a set of Fenders), a Hipshot Contour bridge, and a set of Fender, I think, locking tuners. For the money, grabbing a clean multiradius Fender neck (I’d target 2010 or latter, I really do think this is a new Fender golden era we’re in), any 22-fret, 2-point Fender (or Warmoth, or whatever) body in whatever color you can find that you really like, and then specing out your own pickups, wiring, and bridge, and building it up yourself, will give you a comparable guitar, a little more tuned to your own tastes, for probably a bit less than grabbing a new American Ultra. I won’t go quite as far as Frylock in suggesting you grab a Squier and mod it - I’ve played some oddly good Squiers and a P-bass with J-bass electronics is still my go to recording bass, but American Fenders are still more consistently nicer, in my experience, and I’m not aware of many Squiers with multiradius necks - but I’d take my Fender partscaster over that one just on specs alone (I understand the Fender noiseless pickups have gotten a lot better in recent generations, but I remember the early ones were pretty lifeless and I’d probably still go with a set of Dimarzio Areas over those if I really needed noiseless singlecoils), even before considering it probably cost me less than half of what a new Ultra would set me back.
Food for thought.
So, I finally tried both today (huge caveat below).
The main takeaway:
This is so true and reinforced after actually trying them. My full thoughts below.
But first… a note of caution. I own Fender Player Strat (MIM) that I bought almost 2 years ago. The more I play it, the more I like it… so I am used to a real Strat and love it to bits.
And secondly… there was no stock of HSS ultras, so I tried a SSS ultra and a HSS american pro (which is different, anyway). The middle and bridge SS on the SSS model are different to the HSS pickups, so it’s not even the same sound. It’s a serious caveat but not one I am overly worried about.
Now, thoughts:
1. Comfort and feel.
Both guitars play like a dream. The Ibanez was lovely, what a touch! The ergonomics of the Ibanez are probably a bit more modern and the higher frets feel more accessible. Being used to a C-type neck, I wasn’t too bothered about the Ultra, which felt more modern (modern D they call it), and the chamfered access made it easier to play than my Player with the block in the way.
Not a massive difference between the Ibanez and Fender here. Even the neck profile, negligible differences.
Both have dual radii. 12/16’’ on the Ibanez, 10/14’’ on the Fender. I’m used to a 9.5’’ across the whole fretboard and love it. Both felt like a shreddier improvement. I can live with either.
So, minor differences. I think the Ibanez has a few quality-of-life features for comfort that Fender will never consider as these may affect the final Strat design (certain contours). But overall, I felt both were excellent, with a slight but minimal edge for the AZ.
2. Sound
HA! Massive difference. I didn’t try the real HSS ultra but based on the SSS and AP2 HSS…
Tried both on a Boss Katana 100w at the shop using clean, crunch, and brown channels.
The Ultra sounds like a strat: dynamic, transparent, sparky? The noiseless pickups reduce a lot of the hum, which is fantastic and a great feature. The HSS ultra seems to have hotter pickups, which I would like to try. Based on other sound demos on the internet, it sounds Strat-y with a lot of mojo. I loved the SSS, anyway. Kudos to Fender.
But, how much of an upgrade does it feel from a Player HSS MIM? Arguably, not as much as I expected. I don’t know what that says about the Ultra or about the Player. Still, I could feel the difference… just not a thousand miles off.
Ibanez - way more compressed (higher output). The cleans are great, but not as transparent or dynamic as the Ultra’s. Dirtier and higher gain tones felt more compressed. Not bad at all for more modern lead guitar solos. Really cool sound, though. But way more different than I thought.
The Ibanez has more tonal options thanks to a toggle to split humbucker and add certain combinations. Great stuff for versatility but something I will probably only use twice as a gimmick. The middle pickup felt quieter… and there was a slight volume drop when switching into that position 3. That did not happen with any Fender. A bit disappointing considering the price tag, but probably something I can live with.
So, in summary… very different guitars! The tones you can get are nothing like one another.
3. Other considerations
Conclusions?
Hard to say. I will keep thinking about it but I am so torn as the guitars are so different. I could just grab the Ibanez and mod my MIM strat (notwithstanding access to higher frets and radius), or save to then buy the Ultra in the future (and have both… haha! in the face of a decision, go for both?).
Final thought. I had a Charvel DK24 on my hit list, too, as a high-quality more affordable 24-fret guitar. Now, I am not so sure. I think there is too much of an overlap with the Ibanez, especially as both aim to be a modern super-strat (for lack of a better word?).
Difficult choice! Will think about it.
I haven´t played the Ultra but own the AZ and it is my go-to guitar. The neck on the AZ is just phenomenal. I just bought the AZS version so I could have a “tele” with the same feel. Worth every penny.
Funnily enough, many find it chunky and fat. I had always steered clear of C-type necks and then the Strat won me over when I actually tried it (supposed to be a modern C, not a vintage C).
It shows you have to try as many guitars as possible and that general opinion is just general.
The AZ neck was a joy to play. A friend of mine has warned me it is C-type and very chunky -yada,yada- not for “fast-playing” (the myth again). To me, it played like a dream!
Do you find a drop in volume/output with the middle pickup?
To acknowledge this. You make a valid point.
We have to accept (for better and worse) that the guitar market is a mass market for consumers and the downsides are clear.
As such, there is a gradient and a sliding scale of value for money and I think after you hit the £600 mark improvements become marginal for the price difference. The difference between my £600 MIM strat and a fancy £1500 American pro II with a similar build is more negligeable than it should (it’s certainly not even twice better, despite the price gap).
And given that the guitar is a fraction of the final tone you achieve, well, you do make a great point. But that does not mean there is no difference.
It’s another example of the law of diminishing returns/marginal gains.
I would add to this that really the biggest issue you may come across with this these days is really the finishing fret work on the neck. Most everything built these days is cnc machined, with polyester finishes.
The quality of the actual materials used is pretty uniform from factory to factory. It’s really the lax labour laws and wages in the countries used that allow the lower retail price.
Mouser is fine so long as you know what to look for. For pots, look for something as close to true log taper as possible and with a high rotational life. Mouser in recent years has tapped into the guitar market by offering musical specific items from distributors.
As for floyd guitars, a lot of it is indeed with the materials (metal alloy) and mass of the bridge itself. In the case of these guitars, this combined with the pickups, pretty much makes up the whole sonic signature of the instrument. Go with a company that uses a lot of mass in that floyd, like the ibanez edge style Floyd’s. Add a larger denser block if you need to, and your route can support it. You’re just looking for that mass.
Two follow up questions -
Was the ibanez more compressed acoustically, when you strummed the two unplugged, or was it as resonant unplugged but the pickups were making it more compressed? Pickups (and wiring - I’d probably want to rewire either of these to a standard 5-way) are pretty easy to change, and if you wanted to split the difference sand get something more “traditional” sounding into the AZ, that’s pretty easy.
The AZ is spec’d with the same two singlecoils in neck and middle, and the output diference from neck to middle is pretty modest, compared to middle to bridge (where you do tend to want something hotter). Were the two singlecoils the same height, or was the middle buried a bit? Balancing a neck and middle singlecoil with comparable, much less identical, output should be pretty easy.
The Ibanez website mentioned a flat 12" radius - if it’s actually a 12-16", and if thew stainless fretwork was good enough not to be a concern, then I’d be strongly considering that and a pickup swap in your shoes.
Don’t worry about resale. If this isn’t a guitar you could see yourself playing for the next ten to twenty years, then don’t buy it.
I never use the middle pickup on its own. Its either middle and neck or middle and bridge and haven´t noticed any volume drop.
Hi mate,
In answer to your questions:
Also, I think you are right about the flat 12’’ radius. I must have mixed it up with some of the Charvels I tried (I tried almost 15 guitars!).
It still felt great, but I left the shop convinced it had a dual radius. A pity but not a massive drawback.
Your question about me playing this for 20+ years has prompted me to think about roasted maple maintenance. I am a lazy bastard and will not spend my days oiling the fretboard.
You shouldn’t oil roasted maple, and it doesn’t move with the seasons, which is another benefit to us lazy bastards that don’t want to mess with the truss rod.
Seconding Lars here, roasted maple doesn’t need to be oiled. It doesn’t even really need to be finished to remain stable - the roasting process dries out the wood pretty thoroughly, making it extremely stable, though I suspect the Ibanez has a matte finish on the neck anyway.
Rosewood and, I believe, ebony require periodic oiling, but maple doesn’t really need anything - maybe the occasional wipe down with mineral spirits to clean an unfinished board, but that’s about it.
Thank you for confirming.
The two guitars are very different. As I have a Player Strat which is already very good, I don’t see the need to upgrade to another Fender right away. I will consider an Ultra or other American model in the future (maybe).
I have gone for the Ibanez. Totally different concept and tonal options that do not overlap as much as I expected with Fender. And hopefully many happy years ahead 
(and no fretboard oiling!)