Has anyone been able to anchor their wrist when alternate picking on a Floyd Rose-style bridge (and not one that is locked to dive-only) without affecting the pitch/bumping it upwards while playing?
Or, has anyone either locked their Floyd, set it to dive-only, or changed bridges/guitars entirely due to this issue?
Must one choose between pulling up and bumping up with wrist accidently, or not using a Floyd (or at least not using one to its full potential)?
Yes. It depends on where you are trying to anchor though and how much downward pressure you are applying. Most will anchor in the small space between the bridge pickup and where the strings exit the saddles. If you are anchored somewhere in that area it’s kind of hard to push the floyd sharp unless you are using a bunch of pressure.
I think that @Fossegrim is right; don’t artists like Steve Vai use a floating bridge? I suspect the real reason to make one dive-only is to deal with broken strings or use drop-D tuning?
Not always. Once upon a time thats all you had. The Floyd was designed initially as a more stable somewhat locking version of the the fender synchronized trem, it wasn’t designed originally with recessed routes and the sharp whammy in mind.
Recessed trems didn’t start becoming an industry standard across most/all companies until maybe the mid 80’s to mid-late 80’s, and were often a unique selling point before that.
The other points you mentioned are the plus sides to having a non floating trem.
I said that there are two reasons to block it, (1) recovering from broken strings, and (2) drop-D. This suggests that hand pressure shouldn’t be an issue, and I presume it isn’t, in practice, because don’t most guitars come with the ability to pull sharp where ordinary people can play them? (I’m not sure, but it seems that way?)
I think that it has just become such an industry standard for so long that most companies assume all the caveats are well understood at this point.
It’s not so much that they are designing for the general population more so advertising to a targeted audience who might want that.
People block them for those purposes for sure. When I was a teenager I used to block mine with folded up cardboard for those reasons. Others also may think blocking adds body and sustain, or that they simply don’t have a use for a floating trem, but like the guitar otherwise. it really boils down prefernce.
But isn’t it impossible to do that without palm muting?
Not necessarily although many use that aspect as a plus even if it’s just a slight mute, because it can lend to a more controlled tighter sound particularly on the lower strings. But it really depends on what the application is or what you are going for.
I don’t see that as a plus at all. I need to be able to palm mute when palm muting is called for - not because I have to/am limited to by hand placement.
So the original hypothesis still stands:
If resting one’s palm on the bridge is required by a guitarist’s technique, then a Floyd Rose-style bridge would not be suitable (due to inadvertent pitch rises caused by even minimal contact pressure) unless it’s set to dive-only (which eliminates much of its practicality - no pulling up, no flutters).
Is there seriously no one else here who’s had to deal with this problem?
I’m not necessarily saying that at all, but with that said most people adjust their techniques slightly depending on what they are trying to do or execute. I’m not sure I know of many people that just stick to one locked playing position all the time. Often there are slight deviations that occur that allow for it all to integrate. From your description it sounds sort of like you are just plumping down on the trem and sliding back and forth for your open and muted playing. some of these things are certainly POV or preference related. You may find something a hindrance that others find a positive. Without knowing exactly what you are trying to do, or how you are trying to execute it, or where exactly you are trying to rest your hand, or what the use case is (lead, rhythm, or the finer aspects of both) I unfortunately can only speculate. I don’t really have much more to go on besides what you described and asked in your initial post.
It looks like you have membership according to your avatar. You should post a vid in the private technique critique of what you are trying to do and achieve, and where you are hung up on the pitch issues and have one of the instructors offer their guidance. You have paid for it, why not use it to its extent? I’m sure the one of the instructors like @tommo have definitely seen and dealt with these aspects before.
Let me suggest an experiment: take something with a floating Floyd and carefully tune the guitar so it’s perfect. Now, keeping the tuner on, start playing notes as you use the bridge in a natural way. How many cents does the tuner move (presumably sharp) when you’re pressing down on it? My guess is, “nothing of any siginificance,” but it depends on your technique. Please try that and report back!
Such an experiment wouldn’t work due to pitch fluctuations between attack and decay, and the speeds at which various tuners pick up those fluctuations.
I notice the problem, and that’s all that matters. If I didn’t notice pitch fluctuations, I wouldn’t have posted this in the first place. Since you’re insinuating that what I notice pitch-wise is “nothing of any significance”, I’ll reply that your comments in relation to my original post are exactly that. Not sure what you are trying to acheive by insinuating that this issue I’ve posted about isn’t actually an issue.
I appreciate your ideas. I will post a video when I reactivate. In a nutshell, it mainly happens during fast alternate picking (that’s what we’re here for), which I do when resting my palm (or parts of it) on the bridge. Whether it’s lead playing or rhythm tremolo picking, the issue may still occur.
So I did the experiment with my RG, where I rest my hand behind the string. Treating it regularly—and keeping my usual pressure on the bridge—it goes go sharp, and stays sharp, by a few cents. This is indeed in the range of insignificance (according to standard audio theory). Furthermore, pretend that it goes sharp by X. I can easily make it deviate by no more than half that (X/2) by tuning a tiny bit flat, by—you might have guessed it—X/2.
So, overall, you must be putting very high pressure on the bridge (if I push really hard I could barely get ten cents), but that’s fine, it’s your playing and your guitar.
Well, let’s think about this: did you say that you tried it and had issues? No. So, how would I have known if your question was theoretical, practical, or what? It would be impossible, right?
My apologies that I didn’t make that clear and expected people to know. My fault.
I appreciate those details from your experiment. Very interesting.
The problem with my playing is, the change of pressure more often occurs with the occasional individual pick stroke, rather than from applying pressure constantly. I’m still working at my technique, so this may for example happen with an accent, or it may happen randomly. So compensating with tuning won’t work in my case. The only thing that I imagine would work is resting my palm with dead-steady pressure at all times, regardless of what I’m playing. My assumption is that such steady pressure required for a Floyd is super-difficult to acheive (like elite-level).
We probably also have our guitars set up differently. I only use two springs for less contact points (more stability) - even so, different spring tension (e.g., the various FU Tone springs) yield different results. So my setup may make the problem worse - however, I believe it’s the best setup for tuning stability and practicality, which relates back to my original points.
Some like non floating cause you can really dig in with aggressive rhythm and not have pitch issues.
I honestly tried to get my floyd equipped guitars to do this with my normal playing and I couldn’t replicate this unless I was really trying to push the bridge sharp, and my hand had to be placed well further back on the bridge far from where I would ever normally put it. Now that said, I am using the typical three spring setup, so the additional spring is likely adding stability against pushing the strings sharp as easily as perhaps the two spring setup up might. Adding details like that certainty helped. A vid certainly would help as well so we can at least see this in action.
I primarily play a Floyd Rose equipped guitar. I’ve never had an issue with altering the pitch of strings from palm muting. I rest my wrist on the strings right up against the saddles, and there’s no issue. I don’t press down hard, just enough to mute the strings.
I also use three springs, for what it’s worth, but I don’t see how that would effect it (or how using two strings would add to stability). I don’t normally rest my wrist on the bridge itself, but even doing so I’m not pushing it sharp or flat.
I’m happy for you. Truly.
The more springs, the stiffer the arm, and the harder it is to go sharp or flat. Having three springs, like you do, sounds like a good, balanced choice.