RDT video clarification

Playing Technique
#1

Hey all. So I’ve watched the below fairly recent Reverse Dart Thrower vid 4 or 5 times now.

I’m a little unclear about the purpose of the demo in the first part where Tray gets up to 230 bpm or whatever using the funky three finger, trailing edge technique. Is he mostly saying that’s just proof we can achieve higher speeds or is he suggesting that’s a good approach to use for real life playing? I’ve messed with it and I can get going pretty fast but it doesn’t seem super practical.

I’m wondering if his point with it is to experience the feeling of smooth and fast so it makes it easier to identify when exploring more ‘normal’ techniques vs adopting it as a main real life playing approach.

What did you guys take from that? Or better yet, maybe Troy himself can clarify!

Cheers, fellow cosmonauts.

#2

Doesn’t the video have a bunch of examples of real-life players who use/d trailing-edge RDT to great effect? I’d say that’s your answer right there.

Personally, I’m more madge that I can’t figure out how to make three-finger leading edge smooth and consistent >:O

#3

I just watched this again, seemingly with different eyes I guess…
A few points I gleaned…

  1. I am dense AF…
  2. Rewatching stuff like this can lead to insights…
#4

You mean the thumb bent backwards thing? Why bother? You have to hold the pick at such an angle that it’s sounds scratchy AF, and it’s uncomfortable for a lot of people.

#5

I switch because this is the only way I can reach those speeds with reverse dart technique. I tried to make this clear in the lesson, but the pick grip is not the reason. It’s the joint motion.

Picking motions that have the “upside-down flamingo” appearance look that way because they’re using a different type of wrist joint action which we think is instrinsically very fast. It’s just the way the wrist joint works. And for many players, they can no longer reach the strings with a leading edge index pick grip once they adopt this form. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that many extreme metal players who regularly live above 200bpm play this way.

If you need that level of performance, it’s possible that adopting this arm and hand position is the only way to get it. Note that when you can achieve this level of performance, everything slower than that feels that much easier. So players who want the easiest possible 190bpm will also benefit.

Note that individual differences in hand and finger geometry probably influence what pick grip is needed to achieve this. An individual’s best peformance may always be achievable with this form — that may be unavoidable. But for some people, they may be able to get a degree of this performance with a leading edge index finger pick grip, due to the amount of supination that’s available when they hold the pick with an index grip. And that may be enough from them. Testing is the only way to know what results you can achieve.

This Primer lesson explains further:

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#6

If you use a pointy pick it doesn’t sound scratchy, but no, I’m talking about leading edge. The other one. I can pretty easily achieve a 240 16ths trem with it, but can’t seem to make it comfortable and consistent for playing anything else.

#7

This was arguably the most amazing thing that I have ever seen on CtC. The way that I see it is that the “best” technique is RDT + DSX, and Troy (a) identified it, (b) gave theoretical proof (having to do with the directions that the forearm muscles pull), and (c) provided experimental validation (demonstrated crazy speeds). It was just beautiful.

I don’t think that Troy is telling you how to hold the pick, he is merely remarking about what he has observed and demonstrating what he got working.

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#8

Sums it up perfectly! Good words! :grinning: