Scarified UWPS problems

[lgarcia]

Hey, Lucas here.

I have Just signed to CTC few days ago, however I’m already familiar with the whole world of pickslanting because I watch CTC on YouTube since last year. It helped me so much in playing pure alternate picking. But it’s always difficult to play with UWPS in bottom strings things like the riff of Scarified by Racer X. I consider myself being a upward pick slanting player but I can never play confortably with pronated hand these kind of riffs. I Will post a video asap. In meantime, does anyone have a common solution for this (common?) problem?

Thanks guys

[DJ_Ddawg]

UWPS can be done with a Supinated setup- albeit it’s more “flat” actually. It combines Ulnar Deviation + Extension, Check out the Andy Wood interviews where he locks into his 2WPS Mechanic.

[lgarcia]

I’m watching “Introduction to Picking Motion” right now and Troy is talking about Andy Wood. My picking arm and hand position looks very similar to Andy Wood’s. And just like Troy said, after a certain point, it starts to feel tense in the forearm. I don’t know if I’m practicing it right or I need to switch the way I pick.

I already tried replicating Paul Gilbert wrist mechanics, with no success.

[tommo]

@lgarcia

But it’s always difficult to play with UWPS in bottom strings things like the riff of Scarified by Racer X. I consider myself being a upward pick slanting player but I can never play confortably with pronated hand these kind of riffs. I Will post a video asap. In meantime, does anyone have a common solution for this (common?) problem?

Hey, mainly UWPS here as well, and I also use things like the scarified or technical difficulties riffs to work on my weaknesses.

What can be uncomfortable for me on the low E is the absence of lower strings where I can rest-stroke on the upstroke (I rely a lot on rest-strokes when I can). So I often rotate a bit to neutral-dwps-ish on the low E, in a way that I can rest stroke on the A string on the downstrokes. Obviously I’ll need to rotate back to full uwps when changing strings after a downstroke.

Not sure if I was clear at all sorry - also this may not be the right solution for you, but I guess it can be useful to share ideas etc.!

[lgarcia]

So I often rotate a bit to neutral-dwps-ish on the low E, in a way that I can rest stroke on the A string on the downstrokes.

I was trying exactly that. lets say we are in a 3nps patern. I would pick the first 2 with DWPS and switch to UWPS with rotation to escape the last note on the string, but my range of motion feels severely limited and tense in DWPS on low strings. And on top of that, we have a kind of palm mute in the F# note at 2nd fret (or am I wrong?) which adds more difficulties.

I watched PG playing this riff but I couldn’t identify what exactly pickslanting he was using.

[tommo]

but my range of motion feels severely limited and tense in DWPS on low strings

I know what you mean, if it helps I tend to focus more on the feeling of rest-stroke, rather than on the DWPS itself. Unless your UWPS is very “extreme” I realised that it takes very little to go from escaped donwpicks to rest-strokes.

[DJ_Ddawg]

Alternatively just swipe through the downstroke and you won’t have to change Pickslant at all for the first string and then you’re already in the correct Pickslant for the second string of 3 notes.

I find that for DWPS I use the Yngwie rotational mechanic as pure Deviation ala Eric Johnson/Mike Stern is too awkward for me.

[Tom0711]

What can be uncomfortable for me on the low E is the absence of lower strings where I can rest-stroke on the upstroke (I rely a lot on rest-strokes when I can).

Same thing, different cause here!
I also have a little problem caused by the absence of a lower string. I never use rest-strokes as I am one of those “as-small-as-possible-movements”-victims. But I tend to touch and mute the lower strings with the side of my thumb. That also serves as a kind of guidance which is lost when playing on the low E-string.

[lgarcia]

I know what you mean, if it helps I tend to focus more on the feeling of rest-stroke, rather than on the DWPS itself. Unless your UWPS is very “extreme” I realised that it takes very little to go from escaped donwpicks to rest-strokes.

What CTC video can I watch to learn more about rest strokes? I don’t know if I ever used this technique.

[tommo]

@lgarcia

What CTC video can I watch to learn more about rest strokes? I don’t know if I ever used this technique.

I don’t remeber exactly which one… I watched too many

But I can share here a slow-mo video I recently made for the technique critique section: you can see that my pick is often stopping on the strings that are nearby the one I’m playing. In particular, you’ll see that when I play one the low E I’m always resting on the A. But I must also warn you that not everyone is a fan of rest strokes… I personally like the way they feel and use them a lot to control my picking, but other players find them unnecessary or inefficient. I don’t think Gilbert would do them for example.

6s descending 8x slowmo -

[DGG]

What can be uncomfortable for me on the low E is the absence of lower strings where I can rest-stroke on the upstroke (I rely a lot on rest-strokes when I can).

Same thing here but when playing using DWPS. Once I reach the Higher E I loose sync and strangely mute the notes playing on the downstroke with a too early rest-stroke on the string I just played looking for an anchor point. I do not use my other picking hand fingers to anchor so I am getting used to do that for this scenario. Just need to learn how to stop in the middle of the air.

[DGG]

Same thing, different cause here!
I also have a little problem caused by the absence of a lower string. I never use rest-strokes as I am one of those “as-small-as-possible-movements”-victims. But I tend to touch and mute the lower strings with the side of my thumb. That also serves as a kind of guidance which is lost when playing on the low E-string.

Same thing here. Solved couple years ago.

It is an external aid and it does not look cool (I know, lol, but it is mostly covered by my own hand when playing). This helped me to stop using to much time working on a hand mechanic instead of playing more and working on my speed. I use double side tape and high density foam.

[Tom0711]

@DGG

It is an external aid and it does not look cool (I know, lol, but it is mostly covered by my own hand when playing).

LOL
I was just about to write that one could also play a 7-string. Then I saw that you already do. I’m very much into pragmatic fixes, so this one gets a thumbs up.

[aliendough]

Are you talking about the opening riff to Scarified? If so, I honestly don’t believe that particular part of the riff is completely alternate picked. I think when PG changes positions, and hits that G# to play that 5 note lick, he is using a fair bit of legato.

[Tom0711]

Oh yes, I indeed think so.

Paul Gilbert "Scarified" (High quality)

By a little rearrangement it could also be played with DWPS. Play the G# A on the E-String and the B C# on the A-String. Not even a position shift required

EDIT: at 2:25 there is one little variation where he plays it unmuted legato.
Thomas

[aliendough]

I think the main opening riff has always been played with muted legato, which can sound like picked notes sometimes imo. It’s hard to play that lick at that tempo, all alternate picked, especially with the position shift.

[tommo]

Silly me, I always tried to pick this

It would be great if we now discovered some hammer-ons also in the technical difficulties main riffs, but somehow I doubt it!

[Tom0711]

Nah, sorry.
It’s definitely picked.
Right-hand close-up here:

I guess this is not a real problem for Paul, as this part is basically the “gilbert-lick”.
It’s sixtuplets at something around 130+ bpm I think. And just 3 of em.
Not that I can do that cleanly, but I’m not Paul…
Tom