That feels pretty comfy
Yeah looks awesome. That should be the reference point for everything else. If if feels harder than that felt, it means you are working too hard.
so my problem is changing on a upstroke correct?
Based on that last video which shows you play DSX with ease and your report of the straight ascending 6’s on each string feeling more difficult, yeah I would agree.
Does that mean I should avoid or just start working on the bad one more
That’s up to you. Based on all your other great playing, I don’t see tons of consecutive alternate picked stuff. And that’s not at all a dig, because everything about your playing is awesome. But if that’s a thing you’d like to add to your playing, you could get tons of mileage, almost for free, just by assembling a bunch of phrases that only change strings after downstrokes. It would give you plenty of licks that have that clarity of alternate picking and you’d have virtually nothing new to learn (other than the patterns themselves).
If you’re dead set on DBX, you’d need to learn a DBX motion. Your setup in that last clip is not far off from Andy Wood’s. It’s ‘lightly supinated’ and doesn’t look like there’s a ton of slant.
The way to get that setup escaping in both directions is what Troy calls “9 0 2” picking.
Your downstrokes are already probably doing the ‘2 oclock’ part, so it’s just going to be learning how to get the upstrokes to clear. The way I did that was playing some simple arpeggios like some of the crosspicking links I posted. I intentionally chose stuff that had a really easy fretting hand so I could concentrate on the picking. I focused on just doing small tweaks until I had a motion that was capable of breaking 120 bpm 16ths for the arpgeggios. Pretty sure at that speed, as long as you can sustain it for a decent amount, it’s past what string hopping can do. You definitely don’t want to just play slow and gradually increase the tempo. You need to force your hands to learn an efficient motion and a moderate/fast speed is a good litmus test for it. It’s just finding that motion that is tough, at least for me.
But again, I tried to learn from others’ frustrations. I knew if what I did couldn’t go fast, it was wrong. I’d try to tweak it until something started to feel easy. This thread is what inspired me:
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I think we figured it out I really appreciate all of your help thank you. I think I will probably do both because making lines that use only down picking on the change is something I can do in the mean time and then I will work on the banjo rolls at a quick tempo and watch some of these 9 and 2 videos cause I would love to have that control in either direction.
This has been really helpful. Thank you so much!!
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here is at 120
I think that is triplets at 120, sorry I meant straight 16ths at or above 120.
The motion looks nice and flat (meaning not string hoppy, so a good thing) so you’re probably on the right track. I’d see if you can crack 120-ish at straight 16ths. I found that patterns without the string skip were an easier entry point, but that could just be me.
This was another fun one I learned in the beginning, right from the Andy Wood interview:
I know one nice thing about the string skip, like you are doing, is that it does force the motion to be smooth. Play around with some different stuff and see what happens. No pain/discomfort from any of this stuff yet though, right?
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holy cow that’s fast
no pain but that feels impossible
This was an eye opener for me - I can play the second example more than 2x as fast as the first! I didn’t realise there would be such a big difference!
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I couldn’t do it at first either because I hadn’t figured out the motion. I remember focusing on just the ascending part with little pauses. Just focusing on the speed, not being clean. That was how I stumbled onto the right movement. And that “everything you need to know about crosspicking in 2 minutes” video by Troy. Just following his setup instructions was really helpful. I’m sure you’ll get it! The eighth note triplet at 120 thing you did looked good, we just have to make sure it can go bluegrass fast to ensure it’s indeed the right motion. I know a ‘symptom’ of the wrong motion is that it feels capped and can’t crack that 16ths @ 120 bpm neighborhood (without strain, discomfort)
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Nice! I’d say play a bunch of DSX stuff then 
Whats a good exercise for descending usX and DSX
I think you found my 27 year old problem with my right hand
This is really weird for me to do and I am trying hard but it’s not natural for me.
I think this may really help with my alternate picking.
I have a feeling once I find it it will feel like riding a bike right. It’s a form you go into
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Well let’s give credit to the man himself Everything I know about picking is because I’ve spent tons of time on Troy’s amazing platform. He really did crack it, and he’s continually researching and trying to learn more just in case he’s missed anything. Crosspicking and wrist based motions in general is the most recent thing he’s cracked. I’m definitely glad I could help get you the info you need though
Yeah I’ve heard Troy call the various picking motions ‘modes’ or ‘forms’ or something like that. I think, at least for me, the form that I used to get my foot in the door for crosspicking definitely felt really strange. I don’t need that exact setup anymore but it really helped to get started. Particularly the ‘flat’ palm and the slight bend (extension) in the wrist.
Since you seem to have a boatload of cool licks and phrases already, I’d just say try to adapt some of those (i.e. re-finger) so that you have to change strings after downstrokes (DSX) or upstrokes (USX) depending which you are practicing. I guess that may be tough though since you probably know your phrases so well, I’d bet you don’t even think about picking. Turning them into something else might be more work than learning something new. I can tab you up some sequency-type stuff in case it helps.
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So awesome of you brother appreciate all the kind words too yeah honestly I have never thought about picking until I hit this roadblock
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A Quick answer to this from a former classical guitarist:
This is actually not a problem. I know of several rather progressive „schools“ of technique, who emphasize that plucking motion, and use it as a teaching tool.
One such example for classical guitar would be Aniello Desiderio, who also teaches this to his students.
@Tom_Gilroy I am curious though, since you are very knowledgeable about this stuff. Where do you see a problem in this?
Here are 2 Dminor descending runs, one USX the other DSX.
I’d definitely encourage you to do your own thing since you obviously have an amazing vocabulary already. Maybe those will help give you some ideas to do more ‘musical’ things and still get the benefits of single escape playing. Also noteworthy is that any completely USX phrase can be with DSX, just start on an upstroke instead of a downstroke. The inverse is true as well.
One other huge leap forward for me that I learned on here is @Tom_Gilroy’s amazing research on left hand efficiency. Most fast things I do now, I try as hard as I can to use these “Efficient Digital Cycles” and I made sure to use them on the above tabs.
Check this out in your spare time: