I always felt like I had decent trem due to all the hardcore / grind / thrash stuff I’d play, so here’s doing the table thing. This metronome maxes at 260 so that’s what I attempted. Down the neck-ish view:
Front view:
I always fear that I’m not playing actual 16th notes, I had a traumatizing experience with a friend about this.
What’s that lovely axe you are playing on? Hm for me it feels like playing 8 16th notes and 7 16th notes after that, I can’t explain. Definitely faster than 6 notes but I can’t hear 8 consistent notes. Anyways, this is brutally fast for me 
It’s an ltd eclipse! Their take on a Les Paul. Might have to wait for the magnet for a conclusive slow-mo view of this.
Moved it here because I think this deserves its own topic 
Really awesome speed and it looks like you are not even trying.
I think past 200-something bpms it becomes hard for the human ear to distinguish individual notes. This sounds perfectly good to me whatever you are doing!
So I wouldn’t obsess too much about the actual maths
@tommo thank you for the comments, and for separating the thread! I wasn’t sure if I had messed up by posting in the other thread or something lol.
There was a video that I saw maybe a month ago, can’t remember if it was linked here or if I stumbled on it elsewhere, but it was the science regarding the fastest speed we can perceive (I think there was a death metal drummer in there?). There was a good amount of science and numbers thrown around, but I remember the end “test” was the guy putting a click track in a DAW and just raising the tempo until it sounded like a “note” (more like a propeller to me).
So upon listening to the audio, it immediately sounded a lot more like 8th triplets to me rather than 16ths when you sped up, so I extracted the audio and slowed it down in Audacity to check.
I was too lazy to count it out perfectly, but it seems like it’s slightly faster than 8th triplets and definitely out of rhythm. But to disappoint you, you aren’t truly playing 16ths at 260bpm. By my rough estimate, you’re likely playing around 210bpm (±10) in 16ths, based on an arbitrary 5 second sample I checked in the middle of your playing. It sounds like slightly rushed triplets to my ears, where perfect triplets would be as fast as 195bpm 16ths since 260*3/4 = 195.
The table tap demonstration sounds perfect though. Those are definitely 8ths at 260bpm (or 16ths if you count the upstroke).
@lime Interesting, I wonder if I attempted something slightly faster than 210 BPM if it would sound faster than these clips then! I think the fastest scales I do are around 210, so that would make sense.
I’d still reiterate that this is awesome playing regardless of the bpms - and in fact it’s not uncommon to mis-hear rhythm in the higher bpms.
It is however true that your table tapping reveals even higher speeds than your guitar playing - so one day you may be able to translate that to the instrument - see latest experiments by @Troy
This is a video of Rowan J Parker (very nice guy and great teacher by the way!) where he claims to play 16th @300bpm. Slow it down on YT and he’s actually playing triplets clear as day:
@tommo Thank you again! I’m not hung up on raw speed, as what I play isn’t anywhere near that to begin with lol. I’ve always found this fascinating, from a listening / processing perspective.
OMG! Funny thing is, when you speed it back up, I swear I can hear the triplets, when I couldn’t before!
I had the same sensation But he insists in the comments that those notes are 16th notes 
@Pepepicks66 I’m not sure it’s of any relevance, but the knocking motion is not the same motion you’re using when playing, right? So maybe it should come as no surprise that your tremolo is slower. Just a thought!
I know! I can’t blame him as it must feel that way
Agreed. And as a side note, this is also why I personally think the the table tap test is a really strange benchmark, especially compared to more picking-like motions such as swishing your hand back and forth or rotating your wrist.
Being able to knock on a door like a fleshy jackhammer doesn’t exactly translate to guitar playing. The motions are completely different.
I have a feeling his brain is just tracking his left hand (which seems to be playing 4 notes per beat, although who knows if they are in time). It’s just sufficiently fast enough that he doesn’t even realize his right hand isn’t keeping up since the notes sound like mush anyway.
Funnily enough I have had recent experience of adding it in (I think!).
https://forum.troygrady.com/t/tremolo-tests-with-and-without-metronome/40589/23
I thought that I was doing a rotational movement, but I now believe that although there was some rotation, it was a result of knocking at the same time as a deviation movement that has given me the potential for more speed and smoothness
Yeah I suppose that’s a good point. Maybe the key is just a mix of different table tests then. I also do a similar thing, although the extension/flexion is extremely small.
One concern I have (and maybe you’ve thought about this too?) is that this particular motion might hinder my adventure into TWPS or double escape motions. I’ve been hoping to use wrist extension as a helper motion after downstrokes, since my default is currently USX, but that isn’t going to work if I’m already using wrist flexion on that same downstroke as well. It would just become string hopping. So either I need to get rid of the flexion, or rely purely on rotation, which is what I’m currently trying out.
Edit: And getting rid of that flexion seems impossible right now. In fact, I can’t even control it. If I try my old DSX motion I used for years, I “accidentally” flex on the downstrokes whether I want to or not, so I end up doing a USX motion completely trapped motion even with a super pronated wrist.
I need to start with a disclaimer that this is a new thing in very early stages of exploration - I may not actually be doing what I think I am! But…
Yes I did, because you think WTF is this knocking motion? Its wierd and looks like nothing I would do. However, the knocking sensation/motion is so minimal when I do it right, that it feels just like my deviation motion, but better. I can barely see the difference of the two.
As I understand, you would be using extension on the downstroke. I experience flexion on the upstroke (USX) and extension on the downstroke…
Huh okay well nevermind. That sounds alien to me, although I wish I could do that instead.
Would a video help?
The thing to remember is that (at least in my case) its not like you are knocking on the guitar at all, but the driving force of the motion has a knocking element to it. I (rightly or wrongly), see the knocking motion like th accelerator and the deviation like steering. Combining the two creates some forearm rotation, but is not the same as the forearm rotating purely on its axis (like the EVH spinning tremolo thing.
Also, you could add a tad of pronation on the downstroke as a helper motion for dsx?